Mindset

All right. Welcome to gay men going deeper, a podcast series by the gay men’s brotherhood, where we talk about all things, personal development, mental health, and sexuality. Today, your hosts are Michael DiIorio, Matt Landsiedel and myself Calan Breckon. And collectively we have over 40 years of experience in the personal development world. That if this is your first time listening,

we want to welcome you. We each have our own coaching practice, but in this podcast, we are giving away all of our best stuff. Today, we’re going to be talking about mindset and more specifically kind of growth mindset versus fixed buying sets. And we have lots of great questions that we’re going to be diving into today. We’ll be continuing these discussions on the last Thursday of every month in the GMB,

the gay men’s brotherhood zoom. So you can come and join the group where you’ll have your chance to share your experience. And those are on the last Thursday of every month. This podcast and YouTube channel are listener and viewer supported. So if you like what you’re we are creating and you want to support us head on over to our Patriot page and contribute to the show,

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head to gaming, going deeper.com to find out more information. Now, before we jump into today’s episode, let’s read a review from one of our listeners and this one’s hot off the presses. This is on apple, apple, iTunes, and it’s from the U S and the title says learning, giving us five stars. And it is from, it says blue Buddha,

but they finished by saying the name mark. So mark, this is from you. I love this podcast. They always teach me something or something to think about. Amazing. Love it. Thanks mark. Short and sweet, but it gets straight to the point. He loved it. Five stars. Amazing. All right, so let’s dive into today’s topic.

So today we’re going to be talking about mindset and more specifically growth mindset versus fixed mindset. Now, if you’re familiar with Carol Dweck, then you might be familiar with today’s topic because in her book mindset, the new psychology of success psychologist, Carol Dweck shows how success in school work sports, the arts, and almost every area of human endeavor can be dramatically influenced by the way,

our, by how we approach our goals, people with a fixed mindset, those who believe abilities are fixed are far less likely to flourish than those who have a growth mindset. Those who believe that abilities can be developed through hard work, good strategies and mentorship, which I am very much all about mindset reveals how great parents, teachers, managers, and athletes can put this idea to use to foster outstanding accomplishments.

Dwight goes into details in her book all around how to cultivate a growth mindset. If you currently have a fixed one and how we can better foster growth mindsets in children. One of the main things that stuck out to me was this idea of praising the growth and the difficulty of the journey. Instead of praising the outcome. For example, praising hard work of studying for an exam and how it must have taken a long time and energy to do well,

instead of just congratulating them on the a, makes such a huge difference on the journey. This way we focus on the growth part of the journey and not just the results. And we all know that so many people in today’s world are focused on the result. That’s all they care about, but we all know all too well that in today’s world, all anybody really focuses on is that end result.

Nobody focuses on the journey. If someone was raised with a fixed mindset and only to focus on the outcomes, then if they don’t reach those outcomes, they begin to believe things like I’m dumb. I can’t learn. This is all I ever be. I’m not good enough. I’m not naturally talented because they’re focused on the outcome that they haven’t been able to reach.

But the key thing is that they haven’t been able to reach it yet. The yet is the most important because if they worked on cultivating a growth mindset, then they would be able to process that failure, quote, unquote, failure as a not yet. And then their brain would be able to react and begin looking for ways to grow and improve in order to do in order to get to that outcome.

Eventually now I’m really excited to dig into today’s conversation around this topic and how it affects all of us as adults. We need to begin to transform the meaning of effort and difficulty. And it doesn’t mean that you’re dumb. It just means that you haven’t gotten there yet, or you haven’t learned those skills yet, which is completely fine because that’s all life is.

It’s all about learning and growth. You have the same chances as everybody else to gain knowledge and get smarter. And all it takes is learning how to cultivate a growth mindset and leaving your fixed mindset behind. So with that, I’m very excited to dive into today’s topic because when I, I didn’t read this book, but I listened to this book on audio and it literally changed my life and blew me away.

It, I couldn’t even like, I can’t even put into words how drastically my life changed after really understanding these concepts. So the first question today is what type of mindset were you raised with growth or fixed and what mindset do you have today? And so I’m really curious who would like to start off the conversation we always pinpoint, but what either one of you want to start Michael’s nodding?

No. So I will Go with that. Let’s go with that. Okay. I did a lot of reflecting last night and I’m thinking like I had a hard time pinpointing, I think for a lot of my childhood, I was quite dissociated. So I don’t really have a lot of memories. And I think they’re now coming back because I’m more online,

but so I’m trying to reflect. And I’m like, there was elements of my mum that were fixed and there’s elements of my mum that were growth. My mother is very much rooted in a fear and she’s a worrier, but she also has this ability to, to be unconditionally loving. And she’s always been my number one cheerleader. Right. So that has kind of like a dual impact on me.

And my dad also is very similar. He can be growth and fixed. It just depends on the areas. My parents never put pressure on me to perform in school. Like, you know, my grades were shit and they were okay. Right. So it wasn’t until I got to university that I got good grades, but, and I think for me,

my, I ended up coming out of my family system with a fixed mindset. And I think that’s because I focused on the things that were wrong about me. And I felt like I, I was, I didn’t measure up and I felt like I had to compensate. So how did I compensate while it became an overachiever, a perfectionist, all the things.

And I think it was really reinforced within the gay community because I met my matches, which is other people who come from inadequacy and shame, and they have these fillers and these competency Satori factors that they’ve built into their life. And it reinforced mine and the gay community, which for me was really, I experienced it. I’m not going to say it is this way,

but I experienced it as quite toxic and quite very much a fixed mindset and everybody’s trying to outdo. And so there was this element of it. So then that’s been a lot of my work is healing shame. And, and part of my biggest shame mask was perfectionism. So I’ve been really working hard at, on doing that. And that’s when I,

when I first started working with my perfectionism, I actually got Carol Dweck’s book. I don’t even remember how I learned about it, but I read it. And it was just such a huge game changer for me. Like just even having to be able to have the language, to categorize what fixed and what growth mindset means. And I really started to attribute,

I started to look at perfectionism differently. Like I started to give myself space. I think when I started to learn both growth and fixed mindset and how I was putting so much pressure on myself in this fixed mindset that I had to learn how to give myself space, to make mistakes, to fail, to do all the things. And I would say,

I’m still actually working on this. This is still an area for me that there’s some work that’s still to be done, but it’s, it doesn’t have a hold on me anymore. It’s like very light, you know? And I just noticed that the odd time my fixed mindset will creep back in and we’ll, we’ll be like, oh no, you have to be doing more.

That’s a big thing of mine. You got to do more. Otherwise you’re not going to get to where you want to be, or you’re not going to be worthy enough. It’s all. So I’m still kind of undoing that conditioning, but yeah. So I would say I’m I’m, I would say I have like maybe 80% of the time growth mindset and maybe 20% fixed.

Not that sounds very familiar, the more and more and more do-do I still, I still on, you guys know this spells, but I still have to kind of back myself off the ledge sometimes from that. Cause it’s easy for me to go back into that. So the question, I love this question because it similar, it made me kind of think back like,

huh? I don’t actually remember. So I had to think back and I will say this, my, my mom for sure has the growth mindset and like, it’s a wonderful demonstration of it as far as I could remember. And in fact, I’m looking like I’m thinking about fixed and like, I don’t really think she, like, I don’t remember many times where she would be coming from that space.

I’m sure she does. So I, I definitely had that positive influence on my life as a, as a youngster, but I was not do not take that to me, that I, that I got that at my earliest memories were, you know, really being afraid, shy, socially, anxious, not wanting to do things. I was never athletic,

but I, my, my mom put me in all kinds of clubs and sports, social clubs to, you know, mingle with other kids. And then, you know, all the things that sports were supposed to teach a young boy, but it didn’t work for me. I sucked at them. I didn’t, I didn’t want to be there. I,

and then I internalized that failure made that mean something was wrong with me. Right. And looked at all the other boys who are having fun playing, talking, you know, and I was just like, I don’t want to be here, get me any first, quickly as possible. So, you know, if I look back, I can, I remember her saying like,

you know, trying to be motivating and never in a pushy way, never in like a shaming way, just really wanting that for me. But I think an email parents don’t get a guide into the manual that comes with their children. Right. She didn’t know that these weren’t my things. If, if let’s say there was some kind of, I know other clubs for like something that I was interested in,

who knows, maybe it would’ve thrived and be able to build my confidence sooner, but that’s not the way it actually went a lot. The work I had to do to get from fixed to growth has happened only in my twenties and beyond, especially with starting my business. That’s been my biggest growth. So yeah, I think now today, it’s, it’s,

you know, I, I like that AB 20 United probably go with that as well. Most of the time, that’s definitely a constant commitment. It’s something I have to choose over and over again, it’s not like it’s just there. And like, I got it, like, okay. Never after to look at that again, because those default patterns do come back.

So it’s a constant looking at this and say, okay, where am I coming at it from? Where am I coming at the situation from? Is it fixed where, you know, I’m, I’m limited or is it possibility, solutions, growth, the journey, that kind of thing. That’s me. How are you callin? Nice. Well, thanks for sharing that guys.

Well, for me, it was weird. Well, I grew up by divorced family and so my dad and his girlfriend were very of the fixed mindsets. Like very like, this is like, this is life. It is what it is like good luck to you. Are you remember saying something once? And my dad’s girlfriend, like just laughing and be like,

ha good luck with that. Like just so not believing that anything better could happen. And that’s where I spent like the predominant part of my childhood and like teen years of like developing that kind of belief system. And then my mom, the time I did spend with her, she tried her best to instill a growth mindset. But again, like Michael said,

like they do their best, but they don’t necessarily have the tools. And especially now that we have the internet and everything that they didn’t have back then they did the best, you know, that they could with what they had. But my mom, I always remember her saying just she, you could be anything you want to be. And like, it’s a great sentiment.

And I believe that, and I did kind of grab onto that. And, and that’s like, I think was my one saving grace, but then getting older as an adult, it’s like, you know, that’s nice, but you also have to have money to be able to do those things and that kind of stuff. Because even if I wanted to do something,

there was never any money to do it. Like I wanted to do like dance classes. It wasn’t necessarily sports, but like we couldn’t afford it. So it’s like, I don’t know if I could have excelled. I don’t know if that could have built my confidence quicker or gotten me to that space in a different way, because I wasn’t able to,

you know, go down that road to find that out. And so then as adult, I did have a pretty fixed mindset about things and I’m an Aquarius and we’re a fixed sign. So we tend to also be pretty fixed in the way, like it takes a lot to knock us out. But once I started listening to Carol Dweck’s book about mindset,

everything just started clicking in my head because it was when I moved back here to Toronto in 2019. And I remember listening to it as I was like going out on walks or going on the treadmill at the gym and whatever. And I just remember being like, oh my God, oh my God. And this is when I had my aha moment of like failure to me used to be failure.

And that’s why I used to not try things. Cause I was like, if I can’t be perfect, I’m not going to try because I don’t want to fail. And that’s how I kind of was like, no, it’s either you’re naturally talented or not. And then this is what shifted my mind to like, no, you have to learn those things.

Like you have to grow to those things. And failure just means that you’re getting closer to something and that you’re learning and growing. And so this is when I adopted the mantra of like, I’m learning, I’m growing every time I perceived anything as like a hiccup or a road bump or failure, I was like, I’m learning, I’m growing, I’m learning and growing.

And so I just really have done a lot of work around that and focused on that. I’m learning and I’m growing. And so as a kid, I definitely had a very fixed mindset growing up. My mom tried her best, but I would say that it’s like 10%. And now as an adult, I definitely still struggle with this. I think I’m getting better at it.

And I think that that’s come with like business development and that kind of a thing, because you have to just try so many things in business and like fail so many times in order to get something right. That’s the journey people don’t see, but I’d say maybe more. That was 70, 30. Yeah. 70 30. So it’s like, I’m still pretty good at growth,

but there’s definitely the 30% of me. That’s just like, why won’t this work or why can’t something just happen or why can’t I just be good at this kind of a thing. So that’s definitely where I sit in the, the growth and fixed mindsets. I’m curious, how did you cultivate more of a growth mindset for yourself? And like what ideas did you have to transform in order to become more of a growth mindset?

So let’s start off with like, how did you cultivate more of a growth mindset for yourself as you start to move through like life and business and all that kind of stuff. And let’s start with Michael. Yeah. I think for me, it’s taking action. That was really what did it. So actually doing things, trying, failing, learning, trying again that,

because once you take action, your other people that are gonna fail, which I hold learning, right. So much what you’re saying, or you’re going to succeed and build confidence. You’re going to build that evidence case for like, oh, Hey, I can do this, but what you’re not gonna do is you’re not gonna like quit, like quit before you even start.

So if you’re not taking action, the way I see it as is, you’re just languishing. Like there’s only so many books, you could read it and you do videos. You can watch and plans you can make, it’s not until you actually go out there and start getting your hands dirty, take that big leap. It’s going to feel scary. Everything in your brain is going to say,

no, don’t do it. You’re going to, you know, all the fears are gonna come up with that to them. So for me, taking action and then surviving, of course the worst thing that could happen is failure. But that when, when you’ve reframed what failure means, and it’s not even a scary thing after all right, that for me was probably the biggest thing that I’ve to,

to help create that and really like speed up the process instead of just reading and doing like passive action, which is learning, but actually taking the action, putting myself out there, all that kind of stuff. And then, you know, what ideas did I have to transform was yeah. That reframing failure, failure, fear of failure prevented me from stepping out into the arena at all.

I was like, if there’s a chance I could fail at this. If there’s a chance and I associated with failure with humiliation embarrassment, a lack of worthiness on my part, people are going to see how flawed I am. Like I had all those stories. So when I, you know, did that work on, on reframing what failure means, you know,

in the growth mindset, which is it’s learning, you want to embrace it. You want to, you want to fail 10 times because it’ll make you get to that, that goal or you learn 10 times faster. That’s really the biggest mental work I had to do because I was really, I had a very strong desire to not put myself in a position where I might even fail.

This was even true when I was like playing board games. Like I remember being like I, who, like, I didn’t want to play the board game. If there wasn’t a good chance. I would’ve been like, it was that bad. So I would just avoid any situation. But what that meant of course was I would have, I was avoiding life.

Like I was staying in the safety of, in, in my career sense, my safe corporate job, where I wasn’t being challenged. It was great. I was in the comfort zone and having all those things, but there was something within me that wanted more for myself. And that really knew that I could, if I got out of my own way.

So those are the two big things. Take action and fail as many times as you can. Nice. I like those. What about you, Matt? I like that. I just want to express what I was feeling before. Cause it was really beautiful. I just listening to you guys, both share. I was just feeling like a, like a tenderness and like a love for you guys.

Cause I was picturing Michael, you know, being this like little sensitive and I’m also sensitive like in these like athletic classes and like just not feeling like you’re belonging and Calen, just kind of really just, I know your story and you’ve shared it many times, but I th I think I just experienced it energetically different from your share right there. Like maybe you’re connecting with it differently and I felt it,

but I just felt a lot of love for you and tenderness for you around like your upbringing and stuff. So I had to bring voice to that cause it felt really nice to feel that for you guys. Yeah. So how do I cultivate more of a growth mindset? Okay. So my journey, you know, has been really motivated by shame. And I think for me,

that’s how my that’s, what my fixed mindset was trying to protect me from was being with the shame. So how I’ve cultivated more of a growth mindset is being aware of the defense mechanisms that I have that were not allowing me to be with. And I think the biggest one for me and Michael, you brought voice to it before was the no compete defense mechanism.

Like I’m not going to even bother putting myself in this situation. If I know I won’t be successful at it. Right. So I wouldn’t practice beginner’s mind. I would always make sure that I would do things that I was good at. Right. And because I didn’t want to look stupid because if I look stupid or I wasn’t successful, then I was a failure and I would have to be with my shame.

And the only way to really go through the pain is to go through the pain. Right? The only way to go through the shame is to go through the shame. So you got to go through it. So once I stopped using the psychological defenses, I was able to be with my shame. I was able to be with my low self worth.

I was able to be with all these things. And then I could start to cultivate what I would describe as like flexibility for self, right? Because my fixed mindset, I feel was very rigid. And my growth mindset is very flexible. And my growth mindset gives me space to make mistakes, to fail, to do all the things. And so it’s just this real strong energy around flexibility.

I can’t describe it better than that because when I’m flexible, I’m open to people helping me will even say right. And what happens when people help you while you’re more likely to be successful. Right. But if you’re like, oh, I got to do it all on my own and you’re not successful. Right. So it’s just these little tiny micro things that all accumulated that that helped me.

And then what ideas did you have to transform in order to become a more, that’s why I think I answered that one, but what I will say is this balance between being and doing, because the fixed mindset for me was very much about doing, and I have to do more in order to be successful. And when I went through, what I went through over the last two years was a submission.

I really feel like it was a submission. Like my ego was being submitted. I was being asked by the university practice, more humility and love and these things. And when I, when I did that, it was almost like through that submission, like I, I had to slow down and I had to be more right. And I started to practice things like authentic relating.

And, you know, even today I practiced just coming into this podcast without anything prepared. Right. And just these things were just like, I’m allowing myself to enter the arena where mistakes could be made. I could become embarrassed. I could screw up. And, and like Michael said, facing your fears. And when the more and more that I do that,

the more and more I develop tolerance to shame and fear and the things that were driving me to, to want to activate the fixed mindset. And then it’s given me a lot of space to be able to practice the growth mindset. So yeah. I w I, oh, sorry. Or you want to say something, Michael? I just want to say that that’s the perfect word I was looking for.

Matt said it, it was tolerance. So are we a failure tolerance? If you go out and fail a hundred times, you’re like failure, you won’t even be a thing you’re like, yeah, yeah. I got this. No problem. That’s a great word. So failure tolerance. Thank you. And this is perfect because it goes into something that came up as you were talking,

Matt, and I want to know how this can come into play in regards to dating, because a lot of people are afraid of dating because of failure. And they don’t have a growth mindset when it comes to dating. They have a fixed mindset either. I need to be perfect so that I can date this person and be their boyfriend, or I’m not even going to try at all.

And when you were talking, Michael, you were talking about like board games and winning. And like, I’m just not going to play if I’m not going to win. And I’m really curious, do you think that this plays in a lot to dating and relationships? Yeah. A hundred percent. Yes. Big nods across the board. Yeah, for sure.

Yeah. I did it. And fear, fear of intimacy I would say is the biggest one because when we have a fixed mindset, it’s like, I have to show up and I have to be all of these things to everybody that was me for, for so long. And that triggers envy. It triggers jealousy. Right. But when you start practicing humility,

you realize that you can’t be everything to everybody or to somebody. Right. And, and so that’s the growth mindset it’s like, okay, I’m going to be the best that I can be in this relationship and offer all of my, my, the things that make me amazing, but I’m not going to try and be things that I’m not. So I could fit in and be perfect for somebody.

Right. And that’s the space you just give yourself space, I think, to just be who you are and which is very growth mindset, giving yourself space to be who you are without trying to be performative. So, yeah. Great way to tie that in. It could replace failure with rejection. Like in the dating sense, it’s almost the same thing.

And we have this module in our building, better relationships course for the guys there who have done that. There’s a whole lesson on rejection, reframing rejection in very much the same way we’re talking about here. You know, it’s not like you, you’re at you’re at the limit of your abilities, in a relationship. And then like, if there’s nothing else,

like there’s no one out there for you, it’s a matter of a commitment to keep going, picking yourself up, dusting yourself off, letting it hurt. Which of course it does. We’re not denying that. Letting it hurt processing it and then doing it again and then learning. Definitely. Yeah, no, I just thought it was very interesting. Cause it was like,

oh, this is interesting if people who like want to date, but then they never seem to go on dates. So they don’t process things. Well, it’s like maybe because it’s a fixed mindset versus a growth mindset in regards to that. And it kind of, this kind of comes up perfect for the next question, which is what does your fixed mindset say,

AKA your inner Savage tour versus when you’re in a growth mindset. So Matt, do you want to start off with this one? So when you’re stuck in like a fixed mindset, what does that inner saboteurs saying to you? There’s this energy of like keeping up, like I got to keep up with, I don’t even know who the fuck I’m keeping up with.

Right. It’s like, it’s just so silly. It’s such an ego thing, right? It’s like, maybe it’s people I’m comparing myself to, or people that I admire and it’s just displaced instead of it being admiration, you know, you apply judgment to it and it becomes jealousy or envy or whatever, but there’s that, that element to it. And there’s this,

there’s this other, this other energy of like having to get it right. And control perception because I want people to see me as competent. Right. And if you think it’s, that’s really interesting because when you think about the fixed mindset, it’s like about a lot of it is about perception, right? Cause like, would we really have a fixed mindset if we were just the only person on this planet?

No, because who are we ref referencing to? Who’s our what’s, what’s our reference point. Right. So I just think there’s this element of like, and that was my people-pleaser control perception. Make people think I am who I want to be seen as. And, and so that’s what my inner cyber torque does is it tries to manipulate and tries to make sure that people see me the way I want to be perceived as,

and then, you know, I’m, I’m letting go of this and that’s how I’m giving myself space because it’s like, well, I don’t want other people to have that power over me. You know, I want to reclaim that power. And that’s my reclamation process of codependency is like other people aren’t going to be my reference point. I’m going to be my reference point.

Right. And I think that’s a, that’s a big part of it. So I’m trying to think if there’s anything else I feel complete. I’ll leave it there. Yeah. What about you, Michael? Yeah, a lot of what Matt said resonates with me. Yeah. A lot of the same, a lot of trying to control. I think that’s where my,

on that I think I know that’s where the perfectionism comes from. So like before I put this thing out into the world, whether it’s myself or something I’ve done, it needs to be perfect because I really want to be perceived as, you know, whatever smart, competent, all those things versus now what I do is okay, it’s good enough, 80%,

60%, whatever it is off it goes. And then it opens me up to like, it’s that, you know? And then when there’s mistakes and I wish another believe there would be, then it’s like, okay, well, that’s that that’s okay. But what I’ve learned in strictly a business sense is when, when I did that, when I kind of let go of that perfectionism a little bit more and just started producing more and putting myself out there more,

even if it wasn’t quote unquote perfect. Now that, that exists anyway, my business boomed after that, because I was just more in it authentically me, first of all. And I was just, just producing at a different level and from a very, I guess, authentic, more authentic way. And so it really changed. And then I got more confident,

right? That’s that’s the funny thing. Right? We take action. We face the fear we realize, okay, that wasn’t so bad. Yes. I flubbed up on this and I didn’t say that. Right. Or that didn’t go the way I wanted it to go, but Hey, I survived to live another day. Well, let’s do it again.

And it kind of became this wonderful momentum of like, this is great if I’m just doing this for the fun of it. And, and, and the, the business results are coming, like things are working. Then I feel like I’ve found the secret sauce. So I think that is a lot, that’s one of the mindset shifts or that’s one of the differences is just,

just jump anyway, even though you’re not ready, another one would be, I think, Helen, you said that with your mom, my mom would say the same thing. You could do anything you set your mind to. She would like, I can hear her voice. She said that to me so many times versus I think when I’m in that fixed it’s I just can’t do this.

Like I am just, this is just not for me. Like something it’s I don’t have the potential within me. And the only caveat is the one I mentioned at the beginning, which is if it’s something that truly calls you, like, if it’s something that just has always kind of been there and something you really want to do, then I believe the universe does not give us these desires and does not also give us the potential to create them.

Like we have them both. So if it’s there and it’s genuine and surreal, then yes, it wouldn’t necessarily be like, oh, I want to be a pro basketball player. That’s not something that’s authentic to me. So it’s not something I’m going to, I’m going to feel aligned with. So I think where it is aligned is where it really truly does come from a,

I don’t a deeper inner place. And then the ownership and blaming. So when I’m in that fixed mindset, it sounds a lot of I’m looking around at the rest of the world and blaming my upbringing, blaming other people, blaming the government, blaming the economy, blaming, blaming, blaming, blaming COVID versus a growth mindset is like, yes. And so yes,

there is COVID. And so what, how is Michael gonna show up and slay, even in the midst of a pandemic, how is Michael gonna show up and, and do these things I want to do try new things, even in the midst of those very real challenges, and again, not diminishing the challenges they are there and what it’s, it’s the S and I love that.

I love that from both of you guys. And I definitely resonate with that because I think my, my inner fixed mindset always goes, it’s not perfect that you can’t do it. You can’t put it out there. You don’t know enough yet. You can’t do that. Or, you know, you don’t have enough support. You, you know, you don’t have enough information.

And it’s just so much fear based thinking that it’s just like, oh no, no, no, it’s not ready. What are people gonna think? And all these kinds of folds, perfectionist, things like that, we’re saying, and I need to really, part of my journey is really working on that and not caring, but taking what people say with a grain of salt and that everybody has their own shit that comes with whatever they say.

So it’s like putting something out there and it’s like, okay, it’s 80% good done is better than, you know, perfect. So it’s like, get it done, get it out there because no matter what you put out there, it’s going to grow and it’s going to evolve and it’s going to change, just like, look at musical artists. They don’t just put out one album and then create the same music over and over and over and over again and do the same stuff over again.

They’re constantly reinventing and trying new things and evolving. And that’s part of a, you know, a growth mindset. And even with, you know, business people, I love any Porterfield. She has a course that, you know, she’s put out there, but she’s always improved the course over the years because you get feedback from people who, you know,

bring you the information and that feedback. Isn’t an attack saying that you’re not perfect. It’s saying here’s a way to grow and improve. And so this is where the, you know, the mindset switch needs to come in with everybody is that the fixed is like, it’s not perfect. These people are attacking me for not being good enough. That’s fixed switching over into growth is these people are giving me important feedback to help me improve this so that I can improve it for them.

And it’s like a cyclical cycle of, you know, better. It gets better. It gets better. And I think when I’m in my growth mindset that I I’m kind of in that, like, I don’t want to say super man kind of energy, but like, I feel like I’m like, I can do anything. And it’s like, it’s not going to be perfect.

I never said it would be perfect, but I can do the things that I set my mind to. And like you said, Michael, it’s not things that don’t align to me. It’s like stuff that I’ve always wanted or things that I want to do and achieve. I just got to keep going and learning and growing. And eventually the only true failure I see in my mind is if you don’t try,

or if you stop, I think that you can succeed at anything as long as you keep going. And it will, it could continue to grow and evolve and change. But the only true failure is really giving up on yourself and just completely stopping. So I’m curious, what’s something you can share that can help people that can help you on your growth journey that you know,

may help listeners. So what really helped you that you think can help people who are listening today to kind of develop more of this growth mindset that start off with Michael? Hmm. Okay. Well, even the word fixed, I don’t even like that word because nothing is fixed. The world is always changing. We’re always changing whether we know it or not,

whether you want to, or not, things are changing. So nothing is static. So own the fact that I’m really into the word ownership these days own the fact that you can direct or at least influence what that change looks like. It’s like complete ownership. Like instead of again, being at the, being at the whim of the world, you realize,

wait a minute, I am the one who’s who’s in the wheel here. I’m driving the bus. I know what the journey, I can decide what to put in the GPS. I can decide what to do, but that ownership is scary for a lot of people. It was for me as well, because then you have to make decisions and you have to be responsible when you have to,

you know, you have to go through those fears. So I think ownership of your life and the decisions you make really helps me and, and may help them as well. I think as the first step, you just got to own this as your life. No, one’s going to come swoop in and fix it for you. And then the second thing is,

and this, this serves me more now where I am now in my journey is I’ve adopted a future self Michael, who is like all knowing all wise old, beautiful has everything I’ve ever wanted and just has, has had the most amazing, extraordinary life. And I tap into him as if he is, as if he is another being out there. And I kind of look from that perspective at a challenge I’m facing in today’s world.

And I say, okay, well, what future Michael do? And there really gets me thinking in that future sense, which is like, I’m going back to the growth mindset, all about possibilities, not about where I am today, because where I am today is just a reflection of the past, which is great. It’s taken me this far. Like I said,

it’s always an evolution, but if I can then tap into, okay, where, where am I going? And then tap into that guy. He has the answers, he’s done all the things that I’m currently today afraid of. He’s done them and he’s mastered them. So I asked him, say, listen, what would that guy do? And those are probably that,

that specifically is something that I use almost everyday for myself and in my own self work. I love that. That’s awesome. I love I’m going to start doing That. Now. What about you? So I wrote down, don’t wait until you’re perfect to take action. And my, I think my journey over the last five years, I’ve learned how to shift from a fixed to a growth mindset through my relationship with my body,

because my body, I was so hard on my body, punitive. My body had to look perfect and it never, it was never enough. That’s that’s the, at the end of the day, that’s the, that’s the moral of my story. It was never enough. I was never enough because I had, I just kept, I kept pushing back the destination of success you get here.

And before you’re even revel in the enjoyment of what you’ve accomplished, I’ve already pushed it back. So I never felt like I was enough. And I think over the last three years, I haven’t been, I haven’t been working out. I have barely been, you know, I still eat moderately healthy, but I let myself indulge and enjoy. And I’ve given myself space to just be,

that’s the biggest thing. And I think, you know, in that, that I’ve learned the true definition of humility, which I keep bringing up. And, but it, it really is the medicine for me, like humility has been the medicine for so many things. I think it’s the antidote to unconscious ego or unhealthy ego. And, and it is the energy to which I was able to start embracing my imperfections.

And in some cases celebrating my imperfections. And when I started to share my imperfections, I actually realized that people appreciate that and they love those aspects of me. So I just think that this whole notion of like, don’t wait until you’re perfect to take action. Like you got to give yourself the space right. To, to be imperfect, to just take action anyway,

and you’ll learn and you’ll grow as you go along. And that’s what happened with me is I learned how to, how to practice humility through taking risks and, and, and like listening to my, listening to my heart and listening to my soul. And I think that that’s the other aspect of it is like I started to develop a softer, more loving relationship with my body.

And that’s, that’s how I learned in body movement. Right. Which is, you know, being with your body and being in the beingness of the, of the human experience. And that is very much, like I said earlier, the growth mindset is very being energy for me. And, and it’s in that being under that, I was able to really give myself the space that I needed to,

to not be perfect. So, yeah. Nice. Awesome. Well, I would say for number one, check out Carol Dweck’s book mindset, fantastic place to start. And then the second part is I adopted a very James clear perception of 1% at a time. And so I look at improvement and myself and things I’m working at as a 1% of the time.

I don’t look at it as like, I need to be the final product, the 100% I’m starting at zero. And I only expect to do 1% at a time to get to that 100% eventually. And that is growth mindset for me. So something silly, like I started doing pushups at night before I go to bed and I only started off doing one every night.

And then I just followed that habit and then eventually moved up to two and three. And now I’m like at five, between five and eight. And I just kind of listened to my body of how many I can do. But at the end of this year, I’m going to have done at least over 365 questions, probably a lot more cause I’ve been doing a lot more,

but that wouldn’t have happened if I had expected myself to do 30 or 40 push-ups a night to start off with, because to me that was an unrealistic expectation of me needing to be perfect right away. And so I started at one. And so doing that 1%, that little bit at a time, that’s what really has helped me cultivate more of a growth mindset is that let myself to continue to learn,

but still put action to the things that I’m doing. So that eventually it does, you know, it’s like compound interest. It just keeps building and building and building. So, yeah, so adopting a 1% at a time mindset of like improvement. And it’s just like 1% better than no percent. Eventually at the end of the year, you’re going to have accumulated a certain amount other than not trying or not starting at all.

And that I think in that, it allowed me to kind of just give myself a break to like, not be perfect and to just embrace the imperfections and just to kind of like let myself learn and grow. So that’s what I would say. My, my biggest tips are for everybody. So in saying that I think we’re wrapping things up. Is there anything anybody else wants to finish off with before we head out here?

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